Sept. 15, 2019

Becoming still with Tom Cronin

Becoming still with Tom Cronin
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Becoming still with Tom Cronin
Becoming still with Tom Cronin
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Season 4 Psychology & Neuroscience Mindfulness & Acceptance Positive Psychology

We are at an incredibly challenging time on the planet right now. Depression and anxiety are on the rise and we’re starting to see that our current global paradigm needs to change in order for us to survive. Tom Cronin is an ex-financier turned global meditation expert who is soon to release his film The Portal. Tom talks to Cass Dunn about how personal transformation can spark a global shift and how stillness can create an opening that reveals the true nature of human existence.https://entertheportal.com/Connect with Cass:www.crappytohappypod.comhello@crappytohappypod.com www.instagram.com/crappytohappypodwww.tiktok.com/@crappytohappypodJoin the free 7-day Happiness Challenge:www.cassdunn.com/happiness

Connect with Cass:

www.cassdunn.com
www.instagram.com/cassdunn_xo

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Transcript
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A listener production.

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Hey guys, you're listening to Crappy to Happy. I'm cast done.

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I'm a clinical and coaching psychologist, a mindfulness meditation teacher,

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and author of the Crappy to Happy books. In this series,

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we look at all of the factors that might be

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making you feel crappy and give you the tools and

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the techniques that will help you to overcome them. In

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each episode, I introduce you to interesting, inspiring, intelligent people

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who are experts in their field, and my hope is

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that they will help you feel less crappy and more happy.

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Today I'm speaking with Tom Cronin, who is a meditation

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teacher and founder of the Stillness Project. Tom was working

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in high finance when he found himself experiencing anxiety, panic,

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and even agrophobia. He discovered meditation and it changed his life.

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And now Tom is on a mission to spread the

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power of stillness throughout the world and get one billion

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people to meditate. Tom's just completed a documentary and a

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book called The Portal, which is a deep dive into

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stillness and the profound effects meditation can have on everyone.

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I wanted to speak to Tom because at a time

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when things are seriously dire.

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The planet is clearly in trouble.

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It seems like there is no better time for us

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to be looking internally and asking ourselves how can we

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improve the world, and also how can we improve ourselves.

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Here's Tom.

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I'll start back when it all began in the finance industry.

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I was a broker trading swaps and bonds on global markets,

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and the first stages of that career I was experiencing

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some strong sort of stress responses in the body. I

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kind of got swept up in the late eighties early

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nineties of the Wolf of Wall Street style life in

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the finance market, so lots of drugs, lots of partying,

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lots of working hard. It was pretty frenetic and fast paced,

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and in my body was showing symptoms of response. You know.

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I was getting anxiety, panic attacks, depression, and it kind

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of exacerbated into quite an extreme state where eventually I

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was seeing psychiatrists and put on pharmaceutical drugs. But I

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just kind of felt that there must have been another alternative.

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So that's when I discovered meditation, and it really was

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quite a pivotal turning point in my life where I

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kind of defined my life as pre meditation and post meditation,

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because it really was quite a big shift that started

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to happen and put me on a new trajectory. And

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you know, over the years, I continued on in finance,

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but meditation became a bigger and bigger part of my life.

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And I started to see the bigger and bigger impact

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that meditation was having not just in my life, but

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in other people's lives. So I then got very moved

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and inspired to really bring mainstream even meditation into the

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mainstream you allow it to be accessed by people around

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the world. I was just incredibly inspired to enable people

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around the world to be able to access it. So

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I created the Stillness Project, which was a global movement

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twins by a billion people to meditate daily. Part of

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that was to create this film called The Portal and

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a book called The Portal, and that's just on the

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cusp of being released out into the world.

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Now, Wow, that's a fascinating story, and I want to

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just go all the way back to.

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Then I discovered meditation.

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So can I just ask so out of that, you know,

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fast paced, high stress lifestyle, drugs.

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You know, mental health issues going on. How did you come.

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Across meditation as a solution.

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Actually developed agrophobia, and what that is is the inability

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to leave the house. So i'd I guess found that

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walking out the front door, getting on a bus, you know,

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buying a train ticket, going into the city, just being

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in my job was too overwhelming for my nervous system.

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This is what we call him pruga in Sanskrit, prug

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your parade. And that's the mistake of the intellect, where

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the intellect is seeing things in a particular light that

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aren't necessarily true. That's too overwhelming in a situation. So

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I'm at home with agrophobia in nineteen ninety six, and

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it's not the nicest experience to have agrophobia full stop,

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but to have it in ninety ninety six, pre internet,

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pre YouTube, pre Foxtella, Netflix, it's kind of really boring.

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So I'm at home watching a lot of free to

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wear TV. And they had a documentary about a property

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developer called Bruno Grollo. It was a big property developer

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in the late eighties early nineties, and they were doing

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a profile on him in his success, and there was

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a tiny slither of that story where he was talking

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about how we used meditation to help him become successful,

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and they showed him actually sitting in a chair in

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a suit, meditating, and I was like, it completely rewrote

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the script inside my head of what I thought meditation was,

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you know, lotus position in monks and shaved heads. I'd

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never really come across meditation in my life at that point.

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But to see this man in a suit, a businessman,

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a very successful man, meditating, sitting in a chair, it

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just was like this epiphany went on, and then I

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had this incredible excitement in my body about what was possible.

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And at that point, of course, it's ninety ninety six,

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so there's no Google and no Internet. So I picked

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up the Yellow Pages and started to look through meditation

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and I distinctly recall seeing all the different meditation centers

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under m and ringing them up and asking them about

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workshops and introductory classes and talks and things like that.

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And that's when I started my journey into exploring meditation.

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And what did you So you took yourself along to

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a class, And I'm really curious to hear about like

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what your immediate experience was, you know, how you what

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were the immediate benefits? I guess because you obviously did

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notice immediate benefits for you to continue on the path

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that you have?

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How did it change you?

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Yeah? First and foremost, you know, I did research a

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lot of different styles and techniques. You know, there was

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chakra clearing and Tibetan bowls and all sorts of different

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techniques ualization. But it wasn't until I came across as

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actually an introductory talk I actually wanted to sign up.

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There was one called transcendental Meditation, and it was in

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big red in the yellow pages. So I rang them

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up and they said, no, you can't sign up, you

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have to come to an introductory talk. So I went

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to the intro talk and the teacher was a neuroscientist.

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He was a doctor, and he was also talking about

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things like that certain insurance companies in America were giving

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premiums on their policy or something around the fact that

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if you meditated they could see the benefits and so

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it would it be cheaper. And there was schools and

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research and studies and it was just so science based.

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And so he was talking about outcome oarented fulfillment versus

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internal fulfillment, and it was like everything that he was

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saying was just ticking all the boxes for me, and

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so I learned that technique of meditation. I think these

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days it's got a number of different names, from vedic

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meditation and transcendental meditation, and even I think primordial sound

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technique is very similar. And very quickly, what I noticed

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was a lot of the symptoms that I was experiencing

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in my body started to drop away literally in the

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first week, particularly insomnia, and I was going out of

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sympathetic nervous system state and into the parasympathetic nervous system states.

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So my biochemistry started to change very very quickly, and

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a lot of those anomalies that were showing up as

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a result of extreme sympathetic nervous system state for long

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periods of time simply got dissolved, and my body started

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to correct itself by getting the deep rest in the meditation.

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I'm so glad that you're talking about this, because I

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do think there are still a lot of people even

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now who still consider that meditation is lotus position, shaved

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head monks who can't I don't know who, somehow don't

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connect these very practical, real life, day to day benefits

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like in our busy modern world. I'm reminded as you're

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talking actually of Dan Harris, who you no doubt have

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heard of as well. He was the anchor of Good

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Morning America. I think it was in the United States.

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I had a panic attack on live TV. And he

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had a similar story where he pursued studying meditation, and

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obviously his whole carnish dick as well is like that,

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you can be a meditator and it doesn't mean you

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lose your edge. In fact, oftentimes it's how you gain

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your edge.

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Yeah. I love the quote that Oprah Winfrey has and

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she uses these deeper styles of meditation, the transcending style meditations,

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and she says it's only from that space can you

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create your best work and your best life. And what

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she's referring to her as that state of being, that

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state of infinite adaptability, of creativity, of a deep calmness

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that prevails through you through daily experiences that enables you

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to be much more functional, much more creative, much more adaptable,

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and just much more effective, reaching more full of potential.

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And just while we're talking, you said transcendental meditation was

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the style that you immediately began to practice, Tom, Is

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that what you Is that correct?

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Yeah? I mean I tried lots of different techniques, but

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I found that that was the most effective. That was

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the one that really gave me a very deep experience

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very quickly. And it really doesn't matter from where that

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person's coming from, where they're at, what state they're in.

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It's interesting, and I've been teaching this for many years now,

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and I chose to teach it only because it's the

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most of what I've found anyway, and it's very subjective.

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So I don't want to dismiss anyone's meditation practices right now.

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They're all beautiful practices. Just for me personally, it was

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the deepest one I could find and the quickest one

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to access that space. So yeah, when I teach it,

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I find regardless of where that person's at, they're able

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to access these deep states of transcendence.

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And just for people listening who might not know what

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that is. So my understanding of TM as it's known

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is that you are given a like a mantra, right,

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A teacher gives you a mantra and that's in individually

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assigned to you, and then for twenty minutes a day,

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twenty minutes in the morning and twenty minutes in the evening,

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is the traditional TM sort of practice you meditate specifically

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on your mantra?

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Is that have I got that.

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Correct very close? Or are good? And look, you know

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they're the recommendations, but I'm a lot more flexible than that.

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When teaching, I sort of suggesting that these are what

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we would recommend optimal guidelines to get the most out

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of you practice. But let's just be real about this.

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We live in a world. We're not in ashrams, notdning monasteries,

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and that is just do your best to get those

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meditations in if you can, but make it your own

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personal experience and research. You know you'll find that if

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you do to a day, then you'll notice significant benefits.

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But some days you won't get to. But yes, we

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use a mantra and the student will get a specific mantra.

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And the mantra is that it's literally just a device

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to lure the mind's attention, like your phone is a

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device to lure the mind's attention. They're both exactly the same.

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One lures the mind's attention inwood and the other lose

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the mind's attention outward. And the difference with the mantra

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is that it has a quality about it to direct

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the mind inward to a de excited state, as opposed

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to something like a phone or your thoughts directing outward

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to an excited state.

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I've always been really fascinated by this, and I've always

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felt like it's like this secret club, and I've always

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wanted to know how do I get this?

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How do I get a mantra? How do I find

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a teacher?

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It's like, do you so you have I'm just asking

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out of my own curiosity now, but so you have

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to find a teacher and show up to a class

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to be assigned, Like, you can't just pick somebody else's

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or make up your own.

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How does that whole thing work?

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Can you?

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Absolutely? Yeah? Absolutely, there's there's no rules. You know that

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the universe wasn't designed with rules other than a underlying

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natural law which has a cause and effect. And you know,

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no doubt there's been many people who have received amantra,

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given it to their friends, and their friends have meditated.

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Meditation is a lot more than meditation, And this is

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the important thing I think we need to take into

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account is that meditation does change your life. Otherwise why

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would you do it? And if meditation is going to

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change your life. You need to understand how it's going

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to change your life, why it's going to change your life,

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what are the challenges with it changing your life, what

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are the challenges with the technique, And there's a fair

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bit of supporting knowledge. You know, I just taught some

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students on the weekend, and you know, there's about six

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to eight hours of knowledge that needs to be passed

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on to that student to really give them a short

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term and long term understanding of the mechanics of the

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process and what's going to happen as the results of

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them doing that. And what we tend to see is

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a lot of people just getting into meditation through apps

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or through you know, my friend said just do this,

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and I started doing it. And there's going to be

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things that are going to come up in their physiology,

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Things are going to come up in their life, things

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are going to come up in their psychology, things are

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going to come up in their spirituality. That without a

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deeper understanding about that. You know, we're talking about one

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of the most important areas of your life, which is

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your mind, your biochemistry, and your spiritual exploration. And I

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think to not have some supporting information that goes with

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that particularly through someone that's qualified and trained, can get

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a little bit complex. And you know, certainly by all means,

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you know, if you're just using meditation just to sleep,

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better start doing that, but understand that there are processes

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that are unraveling inside you that it probably works better

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to understand what's going on there.

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So can you tell me now a little bit more

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about the stillness project that you mentioned before.

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Yeah, So going back to the technique, you know, one

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of the things that I was faced with personally was

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this dilemma. When I learned the technique of meditation, I

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was just absolutely transformed. It was quite phenomenal how quickly

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it changed my life, and I was absolutely blown away

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by the power of it. And that was pre internet,

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and then the Internet arrived and I started sharing this

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transformation that I went through. You know, I couldn't believe

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that anxiety, panic attacks, insomnia, depression, agrophobia simply melted away

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when I got out of sympathetic nervous system state and

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into parasympathetic nervous system state. The simple repetition of this

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strange primordial vibration was the thing that was able to

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do that. So I started talking about this and blogs YouTube,

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you know Internet. It started to appear and people around

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the world started inquiring with me as to how I

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could teach them, and I was restricted because there was

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a confinement around how I could teach them, which was

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how you need to come to Bondai in Sydney and

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have a certain amount of money because that's what I

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do full time, and we need to talk about that

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exchange that needs to be made. And so that was

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very confronting because people just simply couldn't do it. I

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had people in Finland and Iceland and Mexico and housing

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estates of Sheffield, England that I really felt I didn't

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want to deprive them from the ability to actually be

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able to experience this, and so I disrupted the model

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and credit an online twenty one day meditation program that

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was hosted in a WordPress site through Vimeo, and it

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was a very intimate way of teaching people. I guess

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it's a modified version of that technique, and we weren't

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sure how it was going to translate or work, but

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it was quite phenomenal that it really did have a

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major impact on people's lives. We had thousands and thousands

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of testimonials from people that use that program and noticed

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that their life was changing quite substantially for the better.

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And we started to realize that the process was transcending

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the current limitations of time and locality, and so that

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was quite exciting. And the Stillness Project was borne out

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of the intention to inspire a billion people to start

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meditating daily because we realized that I personally realized that

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we can't. It's very difficult to change things with the

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state of mind that caused the problem in the first place,

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and so we need to change the state of mind first.

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We need to change the physiology, to change the biochemistry,

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and that really starts to happen when we get the

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deep states that happened in meditation.

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What I'm really curious about, Tom, is you were inspired.

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You were set yourself a challenge to inspire one billion

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people to meditate, and I'm really curious to know why.

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So what is your objective?

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What do you think can be achieved in the world

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if a billion more people are meditating every day.

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What I started to notice as a result of meditation

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was that I could start to see more. I could

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start to see through conditioning, see through my own conditioning,

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see through my own I guess fallibilities and programmed fallibilities,

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and I could start to see systems that were set

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in place in our cultures, in our societies, that were

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causing so many of the world's problems a deep indoctrination.

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And what meditation enabled me to do was start to

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transcend that indoctrination, that dogma, and start to come from

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a little bit more and slowly evolving more levels of

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consciousness and awareness that could then start to trans and

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or be liberated from the conditioning of that system. And

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I started to realize that this was playing out across

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the world individually and collectively, and if I really wanted

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to see change on the planet, then we needed to

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start transcending the systems that we were all part of, and

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that would only come when individuals started to transcend their

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own individual dogma and conditioning that were all part of

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this sort of large scale system. And so to do that,

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we needed really en mass large amounts of people to

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start waking up and start to realize that they're part

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of a big indoctrination of a large system, and that

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the only way we can rewrite and establish new systems

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that are much more effective, much more evolutionary, and much

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more harmonious and unifying for the planet was to actually

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have that experience within ourself, and that's just a function

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of individual influencing the collective.

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To break that down kind of into how I would

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translate that or into kind of lay person's terms, is

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almost like disconnecting from our ego and reconnecting more with

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our kind of our spiritual or our soul self, like

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they're this higher version of ourselves that is less attached

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I guess to all of the material, superficial, the money.

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Is this what we're talking about when you talk about

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the systems and the doctrination that's this sort of capitalist, individualist,

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kind of greedy society that we live in.

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It's partly that, I mean, that's a function of individuals

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being caught in what we call ego or the first

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first state. The first state is thinking state, which revolves

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around an individualization and a persona and an identity and

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exactly what you're talking about there. And I'm actually creating

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a masterclass that comes out with the film in the

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book called The Portal master Class, and it's introducing the

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fourth state, that fourth state being in Sanskrit called turia.

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Turia means fourth and we have physical men and emotional states,

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which are all the things we identify with most about

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who we are, which is our temporary nature and our individualization.

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But the fourth state is completely not attached. You use

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the word attached. The fourth state is being or spirit

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or presence, and it's a state of just simple awareness

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and it has infinite wisdom, infinite creativity, and we all

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have access that. It's like our individualized wave states starting

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to now realize as a wave we are actually also

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whilst we have physical, mental, and emotional states, we also

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have this oceanic experience that we just have been ignoring.

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And that's something that we need on mass to start

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waking up for humanity and realizing. We call it self realization,

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realization of self, which is the unboundedness of being.

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You know, I think the reason that I'm so fascinated

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by this is because we are at a crisis point,

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you know, in the world at the moment, there are

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just we look around and we see so many problems.

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We've got the Amazon is burning right now, you know,

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We've got the climate crisis going on. Oh you know,

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we could go on and on about the problems in

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the world, and there's a lot of anxiety, and there's

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you know, there's anger. There's a lot of strong emotions,

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but there's also a lot of almost helplessness. I see

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like people don't know what to do. And I guess,

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for anybody listening who is in that state, how do

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you explain to people that meditation can possibly help? Because

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I think a lot of people see, well, you know,

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if I can sit and I can chant for twenty

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minutes a day and access my higher consciousness, but how

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is that going to help?

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It's a really good question. And yes, it can be

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perceived that doing less is achieving less, but a natural fact,

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we have an external mantra that doing less achieves more.

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And what we're actually referring to here is that, firstly

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and foremostly there's only and always evolution. So what might

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seem like turbulence and tragedy is actually part of an

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evolutionary process that needs to unravel and unfold because of

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the laws of cause and effect and humanity's persistence and

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resistance to evolution. I should say, persistence to the status

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quo and resistance to evolution will determine the outcome. That

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there needs to be some catalyst for change, and that

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might need to be quite tumultuous for us to wake up.

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In Sanskrit, it's called a rashi, and a rash is

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a sort of a crisis point of fork in the

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road where you no longer have a choice. Well, you

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only have one of two choices, I should say, you

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can't continue to persist on that current path, and that

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is you either break through to when your level or

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you break down, and you'll see relationships and companies go bankrupt,

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civilizations go into almost annihilation or self termination, and that's

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what we're facing for humanity as a whole. But the

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next thing, referring to your question, so just going back

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to that, there's only evolution. So even though things look bad,

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they're actually bad for a very good reason because of evolution.

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And the next part to the question is how does

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meditation help all solutions exist to all problems. And what

416
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we need to do is we need to access a

417
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more creative field rather than function from a current mindset

418
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that's causing the problem in the first place. So, yes,

419
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we still need action. There's a beautiful saying chopwood, meditate chopwood.

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So we don't withdraw ourselves completely from action, but we

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function in action from a place of creativity and adaptability.

422
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The problem is lack of adaptability. There's a wonderful quote

423
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suffering is proportional to our resistance to change. And you

424
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can look anywhere where they're suffering, it will clearly identify

425
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some way, shape, or form some resistance to change. And

426
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the change can come of two ways, that's physical change

427
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or in a change. And so what meditation helps us

428
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is become more adaptable, more creative, and start to find

429
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within the field of infinite possibility the solutions to our problems.

430
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I hope you're enjoying season four of the show, and hey,

431
00:23:19.400 --> 00:23:21.119
I would love for you to check out my brand

432
00:23:21.160 --> 00:23:24.079
new YouTube channel where I'm sharing even more tips on

433
00:23:24.119 --> 00:23:26.680
how you can feel less crappy and more happy. It's

434
00:23:26.759 --> 00:23:29.839
YouTube dot com Forward slash cast Done, so come over

435
00:23:30.000 --> 00:23:32.079
check it out. I'd love for you to subscribe, And

436
00:23:32.240 --> 00:23:35.640
if you haven't already taken my free seven day happiness challenge,

437
00:23:35.640 --> 00:23:37.960
you can sign up for that at Castdone, dot com

438
00:23:38.039 --> 00:23:46.079
Forward slash Happiness. So Tom, I guess also, what I

439
00:23:46.119 --> 00:23:48.519
see in the world today is we seem to be

440
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so consumed with ourselves, especially in this smartphone era where

441
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we're all on our social media and obsessed with how

442
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we here to the world, and we're all pulled into

443
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these you know, these small screens. We're not present even

444
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on a day to day basis. We're not present to

445
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our own lives, to the people around us, to a

446
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whole lot of things. We are completely disconnected and quite

447
00:24:18.640 --> 00:24:26.160
you know, just hooked up in this very superficial, busy, frenetic, detached, disconnected, mindless,

448
00:24:26.200 --> 00:24:30.240
mindless world. How do we get out of that and

449
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move to, as you said, to this different way.

450
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Of being in the world.

451
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Yeah, it's true what you're saying. I mean, we're seeing

452
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a proliferation of narcissism and we're all swept up by

453
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myself included. You know, of course, we love to see

454
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likes on our Instagram. I'm sure the Dela a Lama

455
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enjoys the fact that he's got over a million people

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following him on Instagram. And it's interesting how what social

457
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media and the ability to take selfies has done is

458
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really put fertilizer on an e go presence and he

459
00:25:00.960 --> 00:25:05.000
go identity and going back to that sort of concept

460
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of evolution, sometimes things need to get worse before they

461
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get better, and that's certainly what happened in my life.

462
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My resistance, my inability to see this cause and effect

463
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and see what was causing the problems for years led

464
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to simply evolution saying you're just not getting it. We

465
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need to turn up the volume. We need to make

466
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things worse for you. Okay, let's keep making it worse

467
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for a mental. Eventually he gets to a crisis point,

468
00:25:27.839 --> 00:25:30.359
and I think we may need to get to a

469
00:25:30.400 --> 00:25:34.920
more significant crisis point before we start to see changes happen.

470
00:25:35.240 --> 00:25:37.960
But that doesn't necessarily have to be the way we

471
00:25:38.000 --> 00:25:41.640
can as a beautiful saying, a rishi takes a hint. Now,

472
00:25:41.640 --> 00:25:44.119
a rishi is someone that can see someone that's awake,

473
00:25:44.200 --> 00:25:47.079
someone that's wise, and they are almost ahead of the

474
00:25:47.119 --> 00:25:49.759
cause and effect process where they can start to tune

475
00:25:49.839 --> 00:25:51.720
into all of this is not really serving me. This

476
00:25:51.799 --> 00:25:53.759
is I can see if I continue on this path,

477
00:25:53.799 --> 00:25:56.279
that's not really going to be the best route for

478
00:25:56.319 --> 00:25:58.960
me to take, and they will deviate and make that

479
00:25:59.079 --> 00:26:02.400
navigational change before they actually get to the crisis point.

480
00:26:02.880 --> 00:26:06.799
And we collectively as a species can do that as well.

481
00:26:06.839 --> 00:26:08.640
And we're starting to see the rumblings of it. The

482
00:26:08.640 --> 00:26:11.519
myth fact alone that we're having this conversation today is

483
00:26:11.559 --> 00:26:16.079
indicative that this process is already in motion. The mere

484
00:26:16.119 --> 00:26:18.440
fact alone that we've got a feature documentary about to

485
00:26:18.480 --> 00:26:21.160
go into cinemas that is very much about crisis and

486
00:26:21.200 --> 00:26:24.519
how to move through crisis or even prevent crisis using

487
00:26:24.559 --> 00:26:29.079
stillness and meditation. So discomfort is really just a catalyst.

488
00:26:29.119 --> 00:26:31.039
It's a queue for change. And if you're feeling some

489
00:26:31.200 --> 00:26:35.279
level of anxiety, some level of depression, some level of overwhelm,

490
00:26:35.799 --> 00:26:38.319
then that's your catalyst, and that's your cue. It's a

491
00:26:38.400 --> 00:26:42.960
beautiful device the universe designed to support the process of evolution,

492
00:26:43.519 --> 00:26:48.160
and discomfort is the queue for evolution. It's the indicator

493
00:26:48.279 --> 00:26:51.160
for something changing. And so look into yourself and ask,

494
00:26:51.519 --> 00:26:54.039
what is it that I can do that I can

495
00:26:54.079 --> 00:26:56.200
do differently that is going to make my life better.

496
00:26:56.279 --> 00:27:00.000
And we've all heard of meditation, we've all heard of enlightenment,

497
00:27:00.200 --> 00:27:02.920
and there's not a lot of bad negative press that

498
00:27:02.960 --> 00:27:05.359
comes with either of those two things. So that could

499
00:27:05.359 --> 00:27:07.480
always be a really good starting point. And that's what

500
00:27:07.559 --> 00:27:10.559
was my intention for you know, our projects with the

501
00:27:10.559 --> 00:27:13.319
Portal and Stillness project was to inspire people to start

502
00:27:13.359 --> 00:27:16.279
looking within and realize the riches that lie there as

503
00:27:16.279 --> 00:27:18.359
opposed to in an Instagram screen.

504
00:27:18.480 --> 00:27:20.519
And Tom just going all the way back to the

505
00:27:20.559 --> 00:27:24.279
Stillness Project obviously, you know that's had a huge positive response.

506
00:27:24.319 --> 00:27:26.000
Can you tell me just more about where that has

507
00:27:26.039 --> 00:27:29.279
taken you, the kinds of people that you have connected

508
00:27:29.319 --> 00:27:32.359
with with the Stillness Project and what the response is

509
00:27:32.359 --> 00:27:32.599
to that.

510
00:27:33.279 --> 00:27:35.680
Yeah, it's been exciting journey. You know. We've been invited

511
00:27:35.720 --> 00:27:40.599
to speak on stages in Mexico and Dominican Public, Kuala Lumpa, Indonesia,

512
00:27:40.839 --> 00:27:44.359
crossing the USA and met some amazing people along the way.

513
00:27:44.359 --> 00:27:47.880
But what really, I guess moves me and most passionate

514
00:27:47.920 --> 00:27:53.759
about is seeing individual transformation and that's being in our retreats.

515
00:27:53.799 --> 00:27:56.559
You know, I do retreats in Bali in Australia. We've

516
00:27:56.559 --> 00:27:59.960
got one very soon. We're looking to create in Greece

517
00:28:00.160 --> 00:28:04.279
and taking people in a deeper immersion, a deeper transformational space.

518
00:28:04.359 --> 00:28:09.160
We can workshops speaking as well, any opportunity. Really, I

519
00:28:09.279 --> 00:28:13.119
enjoy being able to, I guess, bring something new to

520
00:28:13.160 --> 00:28:16.319
people's lives and give them a greater sense of hope

521
00:28:16.359 --> 00:28:19.039
and also a greater sense of calm and serenity and

522
00:28:19.160 --> 00:28:21.839
ultimately through that more fulfillment you.

523
00:28:21.880 --> 00:28:24.119
Just reminded me that I was speaking last week. In fact,

524
00:28:24.119 --> 00:28:26.680
I was reading a book last week called The Soul

525
00:28:26.720 --> 00:28:27.160
of Money.

526
00:28:27.200 --> 00:28:28.119
Have you heard of that book?

527
00:28:28.200 --> 00:28:28.400
I have?

528
00:28:28.480 --> 00:28:30.920
Actually, yeah, yeah, Lin Twist wrote this book and the

529
00:28:30.960 --> 00:28:33.319
Soul of Money book, Yeah, so have I and I

530
00:28:34.039 --> 00:28:35.720
don't get enough time to read, so I was listening

531
00:28:35.759 --> 00:28:37.480
to it on audiobook last week, so I got through

532
00:28:37.480 --> 00:28:42.160
about three hours worth of audiobook. And you know, she

533
00:28:42.200 --> 00:28:44.880
talks about how the way that we use money in

534
00:28:44.920 --> 00:28:48.680
the world, and you know that money doesn't equal you know,

535
00:28:48.680 --> 00:28:49.880
you can have a lot of money and still be

536
00:28:49.960 --> 00:28:52.759
kind of soulless, or you can have not very much

537
00:28:52.799 --> 00:28:56.680
money at all but feel like you have enough. And

538
00:28:57.839 --> 00:29:02.599
it just really got me to think about how every day,

539
00:29:02.640 --> 00:29:05.559
when we spend money, just as simple as as simple

540
00:29:05.640 --> 00:29:07.400
a thing as how you spend your money, where you

541
00:29:07.480 --> 00:29:10.640
choose to spend your money every day can be a

542
00:29:10.640 --> 00:29:13.680
part of the solution, or you can continue to contribute

543
00:29:13.720 --> 00:29:17.240
to the problem. And I think that taking what you're

544
00:29:17.279 --> 00:29:20.039
talking about about this higher level of consciousness and about

545
00:29:20.559 --> 00:29:23.319
you know, the decisions that we make and the way

546
00:29:23.319 --> 00:29:25.200
we live our life every day, that we can either

547
00:29:25.240 --> 00:29:29.000
make a difference or not. There are these small choices

548
00:29:29.039 --> 00:29:30.960
that we can make every day that we can either

549
00:29:30.960 --> 00:29:34.240
be working towards a solution or the problem. But we

550
00:29:34.359 --> 00:29:37.920
have to be present and mindful enough to be conscious

551
00:29:38.079 --> 00:29:39.480
of those choices.

552
00:29:40.279 --> 00:29:46.200
So rather than trying to be conscious, we spontaneously will

553
00:29:46.240 --> 00:29:52.039
be more conscious when we transcend thinking and access consciousness itself,

554
00:29:52.079 --> 00:29:56.279
pure consciousness. So pure consciousness is awareness without thinking. And

555
00:29:56.319 --> 00:30:00.519
why it's pure because thinking has this polluted effect. All

556
00:30:00.559 --> 00:30:04.160
thinking has a polluting effect because thinking literally is influenced

557
00:30:04.160 --> 00:30:08.680
through our past, futuarries right and wrong, good and bad,

558
00:30:09.480 --> 00:30:13.680
black and white, a lot of programming. Whereas pure consciousness

559
00:30:13.680 --> 00:30:18.599
is just awareness without thinking. Now, when we access pure consciousness,

560
00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:22.799
awareness without thinking, we start to integrate and assimilate that

561
00:30:22.920 --> 00:30:25.319
level of wisdom, that level of knowingness, that level of

562
00:30:25.359 --> 00:30:29.599
creativity into our thinking. So there will be some still

563
00:30:29.640 --> 00:30:32.880
polluting effects that's going on as our mind. You know,

564
00:30:32.920 --> 00:30:36.000
my mind after twenty five years of thinking and meditating,

565
00:30:36.440 --> 00:30:40.279
it still has some influence on pure consciousness itself. So

566
00:30:40.279 --> 00:30:43.279
there's still Tom Cronen. Then the identity still playing out,

567
00:30:43.319 --> 00:30:46.400
and obviously there's levels of fallibility within that, but there

568
00:30:46.440 --> 00:30:49.599
becomes more and more access to that field of wisdom

569
00:30:49.640 --> 00:30:51.759
and knowingness. So when we talk about money in the

570
00:30:51.799 --> 00:30:54.599
way we spend money, you naturally, as you start to

571
00:30:54.640 --> 00:30:58.400
experience yourself more as the field and more of that

572
00:30:58.640 --> 00:31:03.000
collectiveness and more of that oneness, you start to change

573
00:31:03.039 --> 00:31:06.240
your actions. It doesn't mean you become perfect by all means,

574
00:31:06.240 --> 00:31:10.319
but it certainly means your actions become more geared towards

575
00:31:11.119 --> 00:31:15.000
supporting the whole because you experience yourself more as the whole,

576
00:31:15.400 --> 00:31:20.160
rather than trying to satiate something that's completely insatiable. And

577
00:31:20.200 --> 00:31:23.680
that's the ego. The ego's actually designed for holes, and

578
00:31:23.759 --> 00:31:25.759
it will always have holes. It will always have a

579
00:31:25.759 --> 00:31:28.799
sense of lack. It will never ever be fulfilled no

580
00:31:28.839 --> 00:31:31.559
matter how hard you try. And that's partly the problem,

581
00:31:31.599 --> 00:31:35.039
is that we're trying to satisfy something that's unsatisfiable.

582
00:31:35.440 --> 00:31:38.640
Given the benefits that you speak of, Tom and that

583
00:31:38.680 --> 00:31:40.599
are proven. Now, there's a whole lot of science that

584
00:31:40.640 --> 00:31:44.119
supports the benefits of meditation and slowing down and being still,

585
00:31:44.160 --> 00:31:47.720
what do you think it is that that stops people

586
00:31:47.759 --> 00:31:49.480
from doing it? What's the aversion to it?

587
00:31:50.440 --> 00:31:52.680
Well, if you think of the benefits of meditation, primarily

588
00:31:52.720 --> 00:31:55.400
we get stillness and silence. And if you think of

589
00:31:55.400 --> 00:31:57.680
what stillness and silence is, it's the absence of motion

590
00:31:57.839 --> 00:32:01.400
and the absence of noise. And where we are nactually

591
00:32:01.480 --> 00:32:05.640
designed and programmed to go is towards noise and towards motion.

592
00:32:05.720 --> 00:32:10.400
That is excitement stimulation. And it's not an inclination of

593
00:32:10.440 --> 00:32:15.599
the ego to be less stimulated. It's the one of

594
00:32:15.640 --> 00:32:18.400
the motivating factors for all action is to get fulfillment,

595
00:32:18.440 --> 00:32:22.920
some level of stimulation or excitement, excitation and meditations. The

596
00:32:22.960 --> 00:32:26.160
antithesis of that, although it does have immense benefits, it's

597
00:32:26.200 --> 00:32:28.119
not a high priority for us to wake up and

598
00:32:28.160 --> 00:32:31.480
go I really want to be still and silent. What

599
00:32:31.519 --> 00:32:33.599
we're motivated to do is to wake up and go

600
00:32:33.680 --> 00:32:35.960
I really want to have noise, and that's music or

601
00:32:35.960 --> 00:32:40.200
podcasts or TV or something that's going to create a

602
00:32:40.279 --> 00:32:44.319
level of charm and stimulation inside me. And I'm interested

603
00:32:44.319 --> 00:32:46.880
in having action as well because that's going to give

604
00:32:46.960 --> 00:32:49.480
me some level of charm and stimulation. So it is

605
00:32:49.480 --> 00:32:51.640
the antithis and we're talking about a slow burn here.

606
00:32:51.640 --> 00:32:54.920
We're talking about a slow, long term benefit that comes

607
00:32:54.920 --> 00:32:56.759
from these things, and why we're seeing more people go

608
00:32:56.799 --> 00:33:01.160
into meditation because of that hyper stimulation is now starting

609
00:33:01.200 --> 00:33:07.200
to lead to extreme ramifications of depression, anxiety, overwhelm, and

610
00:33:07.400 --> 00:33:11.079
people just don't realize. It's by creep. It's creeping into

611
00:33:11.079 --> 00:33:13.200
our lives, and people don't realize that this is all

612
00:33:13.240 --> 00:33:14.240
starting to happen to them.

613
00:33:14.759 --> 00:33:18.480
So, Tom, you mentioned the Portal a film coming out

614
00:33:18.480 --> 00:33:19.039
in cinemas.

615
00:33:19.039 --> 00:33:20.880
Can you please tell me all about that.

616
00:33:21.400 --> 00:33:23.119
You were very excited to be bringing this out to

617
00:33:23.160 --> 00:33:26.240
the world to film in a book, and it started

618
00:33:26.240 --> 00:33:29.720
with the film and the film we explored a number

619
00:33:29.720 --> 00:33:33.079
of different stories and the three qualifying factors for these

620
00:33:33.079 --> 00:33:35.240
stories that we filmed were that they needed to have

621
00:33:35.279 --> 00:33:37.880
a crisis, they needed to use meditation to move through

622
00:33:37.880 --> 00:33:41.039
that crisis, and they needed to have quite a global

623
00:33:41.039 --> 00:33:43.200
sort of theme so that everyone in the world could

624
00:33:43.240 --> 00:33:45.559
relate to it. And so we've got six stories that

625
00:33:45.640 --> 00:33:51.640
have got remarkable, moving, powerful journeys with crisis in them

626
00:33:51.680 --> 00:33:55.000
that we all come together in those stories in a

627
00:33:55.119 --> 00:33:57.640
moment of stillness and meditation, and you in the audience

628
00:33:57.680 --> 00:34:00.680
will actually join them in a meditation experience in the cinema,

629
00:34:00.680 --> 00:34:03.720
which is the world's first. And there's even some binoral

630
00:34:03.720 --> 00:34:06.079
beats in there to support that process. It's a beautiful

631
00:34:06.079 --> 00:34:09.239
scene and you know, it's quite a different film. It's

632
00:34:09.320 --> 00:34:11.599
quite unique. It will challenge some people because it doesn't

633
00:34:11.639 --> 00:34:15.559
follow normal tempos and doesn't follow normal traditional sort of

634
00:34:15.760 --> 00:34:19.360
processes for making documentaries. And we wanted a unique film

635
00:34:19.400 --> 00:34:22.360
that move people out of their heads and into their hearts.

636
00:34:22.480 --> 00:34:25.400
So it's a rich journey that allows you and inspires

637
00:34:25.400 --> 00:34:28.280
you to surrender. And we've got three futurists that also

638
00:34:28.360 --> 00:34:32.760
share their vision about humanity as a macro perspective. So yeah,

639
00:34:33.079 --> 00:34:35.920
it's a powerful film that is coming out into cinemas

640
00:34:35.960 --> 00:34:40.079
in Australia in October and New Zealand in November, and

641
00:34:40.320 --> 00:34:42.199
we'll be coming out in the US shortly as well.

642
00:34:42.199 --> 00:34:45.639
We'll be announcing that and into Europe. And we've got

643
00:34:45.679 --> 00:34:48.559
the ability for anyone anywhere in the world who wants

644
00:34:48.639 --> 00:34:50.760
to host a film if they don't have it accessible

645
00:34:50.760 --> 00:34:53.199
in their cinema, then we can support them with that.

646
00:34:53.239 --> 00:34:54.320
And all they need to do is go to the

647
00:34:54.360 --> 00:34:57.639
website and enter the portal dot com and there's the

648
00:34:57.679 --> 00:34:59.840
ability for them to host a screening in their town.

649
00:35:00.239 --> 00:35:04.360
Fantastic And you said six stories and three futurists but

650
00:35:04.440 --> 00:35:07.280
I've watched the trailer and there's also a robot.

651
00:35:06.960 --> 00:35:11.000
Right, Yeah, we have Sophia the robot, who is programmed

652
00:35:11.239 --> 00:35:14.519
as an AI robot to be unconditionally loving, and she

653
00:35:14.599 --> 00:35:17.800
plays a significant role in the film because we set

654
00:35:17.880 --> 00:35:20.119
up a premise that humans are programmed and most of

655
00:35:20.199 --> 00:35:23.199
the way we're operating is from an indoctrination, a program

656
00:35:23.519 --> 00:35:26.599
that was passed down to us from generations. And we've

657
00:35:26.679 --> 00:35:30.480
proven that that firstly that we're programmed, and secondly that

658
00:35:31.239 --> 00:35:33.480
we're programmed by a state of mind of the programmer.

659
00:35:33.679 --> 00:35:37.480
And if we can program humanoid robots to be unconditionally loving,

660
00:35:37.840 --> 00:35:40.480
then that gives us hope that there's the potential that

661
00:35:40.519 --> 00:35:45.039
we can also program humans to be unconditionally loving. And

662
00:35:45.199 --> 00:35:46.039
isn't that exciting?

663
00:35:46.280 --> 00:35:50.320
I can't wait to see it. So, Tom, people who

664
00:35:50.639 --> 00:35:54.440
are listening to this, who are on board, Yes, I

665
00:35:54.519 --> 00:35:57.440
need to find some stillness in my life, and most

666
00:35:57.480 --> 00:35:57.920
of us do.

667
00:35:59.280 --> 00:36:01.440
Where do you suggest that they start.

668
00:36:02.559 --> 00:36:04.559
There's a number of ways that can go about this,

669
00:36:04.840 --> 00:36:09.440
and you know, probably the most efficient and effective way,

670
00:36:09.679 --> 00:36:12.360
not efficient, The most effective way, I should say, is

671
00:36:12.440 --> 00:36:15.159
to sit in the presence of a teacher that is

672
00:36:15.239 --> 00:36:19.480
qualified and has many many years experience, and they will

673
00:36:19.519 --> 00:36:24.280
take you through a process, whether it's Buddhist meditation or

674
00:36:25.159 --> 00:36:28.280
Chuck reclearing meditation or transcending meditation. I'm not going to

675
00:36:28.400 --> 00:36:31.280
promote one over the other. They're all beautiful. Find one

676
00:36:31.280 --> 00:36:33.239
that works for you, find one that resonates with you,

677
00:36:33.280 --> 00:36:35.480
Find a teacher that resonates you with you, because within

678
00:36:35.519 --> 00:36:38.559
each of those different practices, there's going to be teachers

679
00:36:38.559 --> 00:36:40.719
that you'll resonate with and teachers that you won't resonate with.

680
00:36:40.760 --> 00:36:43.679
Because we're all different, We're all have different ilk, so

681
00:36:44.159 --> 00:36:46.559
it's very diverse, and it's about doing your own research

682
00:36:46.599 --> 00:36:49.239
and your own exploration. Now, if you can't access a teacher,

683
00:36:49.559 --> 00:36:51.559
if you can't afford it, because obviously you will have

684
00:36:51.639 --> 00:36:55.400
to probably make an exchange, no doubt of some sort.

685
00:36:55.440 --> 00:36:57.440
And if you can't afford that, then simply go to

686
00:36:57.480 --> 00:37:00.480
YouTube and find some apps, or sorry, how do YouTube

687
00:37:00.480 --> 00:37:02.440
and find some meditations? Or go on your phone and

688
00:37:02.440 --> 00:37:05.199
find some apps. There's so many ways that we can

689
00:37:05.239 --> 00:37:09.400
now access meditation, so many different styles, and it's about

690
00:37:09.440 --> 00:37:14.360
just starting with your own research and exploration and commitment

691
00:37:14.400 --> 00:37:17.920
and intention to put into your day just a little

692
00:37:17.920 --> 00:37:20.280
bit of the excitation so that you can start to

693
00:37:20.280 --> 00:37:23.679
connect with yourself and start to find and inner quietness

694
00:37:23.679 --> 00:37:25.960
that is always there and it's just going to support

695
00:37:26.000 --> 00:37:29.400
you through any sort of fluctuating challenges you're going to

696
00:37:29.440 --> 00:37:30.840
face on a daily basis.

697
00:37:31.079 --> 00:37:34.239
And I completely agree about finding a teacher in whatever

698
00:37:34.280 --> 00:37:37.960
way you can. I obviously teach mindfulness meditation as well,

699
00:37:38.000 --> 00:37:42.559
and in the online communities that I work in, you know,

700
00:37:42.639 --> 00:37:44.599
just people on Facebook asking about how do I get

701
00:37:44.599 --> 00:37:47.039
started with meditation? Often they will find an app and

702
00:37:47.039 --> 00:37:51.159
that almost leaves some more confused than when they start,

703
00:37:51.280 --> 00:37:54.159
because there is so much out there and you know,

704
00:37:54.760 --> 00:37:57.760
how long should I meditate for? And what should I do?

705
00:37:57.880 --> 00:38:00.679
And you know when should I do it? There's so much,

706
00:38:00.960 --> 00:38:03.320
so many questions, and there's not really as you said

707
00:38:03.400 --> 00:38:06.880
right at the beginning of this conversation, you know, there's

708
00:38:06.920 --> 00:38:10.840
often not an understanding of the how and the what

709
00:38:10.960 --> 00:38:12.000
and the why and all.

710
00:38:11.880 --> 00:38:12.960
Of that sort of stuff as well.

711
00:38:13.000 --> 00:38:15.280
So I also really encourage people to go out do

712
00:38:15.320 --> 00:38:18.519
some research and find a teacher who can help to

713
00:38:18.559 --> 00:38:22.320
support them through that process. So, Tom, you know, we

714
00:38:22.360 --> 00:38:27.280
are kind of at crisis point in the world at

715
00:38:27.280 --> 00:38:30.159
the moment. What's your view, Do you think we're going

716
00:38:30.199 --> 00:38:31.159
to come out the other side?

717
00:38:31.199 --> 00:38:33.800
Okay? Do you have some hope for humanity?

718
00:38:34.480 --> 00:38:37.440
I think whenever we're in any state of crisis, what

719
00:38:37.480 --> 00:38:39.599
we want to always do is look at this and

720
00:38:39.639 --> 00:38:42.880
go even though as incredibly challenging as some crises are,

721
00:38:43.840 --> 00:38:47.400
is to know deeply that this is just evolution, and

722
00:38:47.599 --> 00:38:51.559
beyond this there will be something that provails. It's even better.

723
00:38:52.199 --> 00:38:55.119
And if it means that humans aren't on the planet,

724
00:38:55.559 --> 00:38:58.639
there's a lot of species out there, plant and animal

725
00:38:59.039 --> 00:39:02.480
that will be rejoiced and that will be highly evolutionary

726
00:39:02.599 --> 00:39:05.679
for the planet. If we continue on this path. Now,

727
00:39:06.000 --> 00:39:08.719
the possibility for things to be incredibly better on the

728
00:39:08.760 --> 00:39:12.480
planet with humans is amazing and highly probable and highly

729
00:39:12.480 --> 00:39:14.599
possible as well. So I'd like to live on a

730
00:39:14.639 --> 00:39:18.639
positive note and say we are an incredibly conscious species. Yes,

731
00:39:18.679 --> 00:39:21.199
we are a little bit resistant to change, but we

732
00:39:21.280 --> 00:39:24.440
also have an incredible state of consciousness. We have a

733
00:39:24.519 --> 00:39:27.760
great sense of lovingness, and whenever we go through crisis,

734
00:39:27.760 --> 00:39:31.000
you tend to see collectively people come together and the

735
00:39:31.119 --> 00:39:35.199
prevailing nature of humanity come up to the fore, which

736
00:39:35.239 --> 00:39:38.320
is love and tenderness and kindness and care and I

737
00:39:38.360 --> 00:39:42.239
think that if we go through a major crisis in

738
00:39:42.280 --> 00:39:45.440
the not too distant future, that those qualities will come

739
00:39:45.480 --> 00:39:48.360
out which are always within us, and that's going to

740
00:39:48.400 --> 00:39:52.079
be wonderful to see anyway, And hopefully it doesn't have

741
00:39:52.119 --> 00:39:54.079
to get to that. Hopefully we can bring those qualities

742
00:39:54.119 --> 00:39:57.280
out pre crisis and we can just start to be

743
00:39:57.360 --> 00:40:01.000
a much more loving, kinder, and integrated planet as a whole.

744
00:40:01.599 --> 00:40:02.880
Tom, thank you so much.

745
00:40:02.960 --> 00:40:06.440
This has been a really, really fascinating conversation for me,

746
00:40:06.519 --> 00:40:08.079
and I have to admit that you have left me

747
00:40:08.159 --> 00:40:11.440
feeling slightly more hopeful for the future.

748
00:40:11.599 --> 00:40:13.639
Thank you so much, pleasure, it's been great to be

749
00:40:13.719 --> 00:40:16.119
and thanks for the wonderful questions. We're inspiring.

750
00:40:20.239 --> 00:40:20.639
You guys.

751
00:40:20.639 --> 00:40:23.000
This is the very last episode for this season, and

752
00:40:23.039 --> 00:40:26.719
what a fantastic conversation it was. Tom's vision for the

753
00:40:26.760 --> 00:40:31.159
future and his belief in the power of stillness, in

754
00:40:31.199 --> 00:40:35.320
self reflection and in really changing the current paradigm of

755
00:40:35.360 --> 00:40:38.320
the world is so inspiring to me. It really does

756
00:40:38.360 --> 00:40:40.480
feel like now is the time that we have to

757
00:40:40.519 --> 00:40:42.719
wake up if we had to create a better future

758
00:40:42.719 --> 00:40:46.079
for ourselves and the future generations. If you'd like to

759
00:40:46.119 --> 00:40:48.079
find out more about Tom's work. You can find him

760
00:40:48.079 --> 00:40:50.960
at his website, Tom Cronan dot com and that's why

761
00:40:51.000 --> 00:40:53.880
you'll also find links to his Stillness project and his

762
00:40:54.000 --> 00:40:57.320
brand new documentary, The Portal, which sounds incredible and I'm

763
00:40:57.360 --> 00:41:03.679
really excited to see. Thank you for joining me for

764
00:41:03.800 --> 00:41:06.559
season four of Crappy to Happy. I hope you have

765
00:41:06.800 --> 00:41:10.119
enjoyed it as much as I have. I'm kastan clinical

766
00:41:10.119 --> 00:41:13.559
and coaching psychologist, mindfulness meditation teacher, and author of the

767
00:41:13.639 --> 00:41:17.000
Crappy to Happy books. If you like this show, please

768
00:41:17.039 --> 00:41:19.679
do go to Apple Podcasts and leave us a rating

769
00:41:19.800 --> 00:41:20.760
and a review, and of.

770
00:41:20.639 --> 00:41:22.920
Course I always love to hear your feedback directly.

771
00:41:23.000 --> 00:41:26.079
You can email me at hello atkastone dot com. I

772
00:41:26.159 --> 00:41:28.719
read all of the emails. I cannot wait to be

773
00:41:28.760 --> 00:41:32.400
back with another season. Crappy to Happy is presented by

774
00:41:32.400 --> 00:41:36.679
Cast Dunn, produced by Davis Vilenski, Audio production by Darcy Thompson.

775
00:41:41.840 --> 00:41:42.320
Listener