March 4, 2018

Digital detox

Digital detox
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Digital detox
Digital detox
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Season 2

Are you addicted to your device? Tiff talks about the challenge of staying off her phone while running an online business and Cass shares the research around the dangers of too much screen time. If going cold turkey feels impossible, Tiff Hall and Cass Dunn have plenty of suggestions for how you can wean off your smart phone or social media. From Shut-Off Sundays to whole tech-free weekends, in this episode you'll learn the importance of taking a break from the compulsive scrolling that has become such a normal (but potentially dangerous) part of our daily lives.Connect with Cass:
www.crappytohappypod.comhello@crappytohappypod.com 
www.instagram.com/crappytohappypodwww.tiktok.com/crappytohappypod
Join the free 7-day Happiness Challenge:www.cassdunn.com/happiness

Connect with Cass:

www.cassdunn.com
www.instagram.com/cassdunn_xo

Contact Crappy to Happy:

Email: hello@crappytohappypod.com
www.crappytohappypod.com
www.instagram.com/crappytohappypod
www.tiktok.com/@crappytohappypod


Are you a coach, therapist, service provider or solopreneur struggling with self-doubt and imposter syndrome? I'd love to talk to you! (for market research purposes only!)

Book a call with me to share your experience.

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Transcript
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A listener production.

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You're listening to Crappy to Happy with Tip and Cass.

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Last episode, we were chatting about the importance of healthy relationships.

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Today we're going to talk about digital detoxing. We touch

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on similar things time and time again because they are

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so connected in looking at trying to achieve balance and

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a holistic lifestyle.

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Yeah, and they are often interconnected. And the other thing

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that we know, and I know this from working with clients,

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and I know this from working in the TIVXO community,

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is that people will say, oh, it only took me

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fifty times to hear that, but now I finally get it.

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And sometimes, you know, we only retain a very small

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bit of information, so the more that something is repeated,

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the more likely we are to hear it in a

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different way or to take it on board. So I

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think it's important.

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It is so important, And you can't talk about any

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of these topics without bringing mindfulness in or the way

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you think, the thoughts, your physiology.

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It is so connected.

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So today we're talking about digital detoxing, and it's something

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that didn't really exist.

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When I was at school, but now.

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It is something that I am trying to tell my

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nineteen year old brother and he can't imagine a world

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without Snapchat and what's happened Instagram?

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That he needs time off his screen. He needs some time.

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We all read them off our screen, probably more important

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for those younger people who don't know a world about it,

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but we are all kind of hooked on our screens,

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and it is potentially problematic. And I actually was reading

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the other day because I was writing an article about

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this topic that when Apple collects data, I don't think.

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I think it was like twenty sixteen. Maybe this data

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came out, you know how Apple collects usage data. Yes,

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and they found that people generally unlock their phones, swipe

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open their phones eighty times a day, eighty plus I

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think times a day. And there was some other research

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that said they'd put a chip in their phone to

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see how many times people actually annually handle their phone

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over two thousand times a day.

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Ooh, that's scary.

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Yeah, it really is. And in fact, I heard about

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a book written by Nancy Collier. I haven't read it myself,

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but in her book it's called The Power of Off.

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She says that she has data that we check our

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phones one hundred and ninety times a day, which is

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basically every five minutes, So that rings true. That rings true.

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We are on our phones constantly.

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It is the new addiction, and it's making us feel crappy.

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Absolutely, it is. The problem is though that we're all

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on our phones all the time, and so it's we

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don't actually know any different. It is the new addiction.

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And the difference between the addiction to our phones compared

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to other addictions that we hear about gambling addictions and

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alcohol and sugar addictions is the other ones we identify

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as problematic and this one we don't so much. Because

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everybody's doing it. It's such a normal, integral part of

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our daily life that we accept it that we don't

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necessarily identify it as a problem, except that we kind

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of do. I think we all know intuitively that we're

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a bit attached to our phones, but we don't necessarily

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relate to the We don't necessarily perceive it to be

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the problem that it really is.

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Yes, and as a psychologist caster are you're seeing other

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issues arise, people feeling really crappy from being on their phones.

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To be hostcreens all the time.

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To be honest, if no, people don't identify it as

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a problem, and I do get asked that question, Oh,

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do people present to you because they're addicted to their phones?

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We'll actually know because people don't identify it as a

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problem because it's very normal, and I think that in

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itself is the problem.

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Do you think that there's been a rise in things

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such as anxiety and depression?

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For sure?

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For sure?

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And I think there will be more and more research

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coming out about this. I know, I don't have any

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studies right in front of me. I know there was

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a survey done in the UK which found direct links

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between social media use and depression, the rate of depression,

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and that was to do with time spent, So two

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hours plus a day on social media was considered to

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be a problematic and considered to be linked to increased

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rates of depression. Now, the thing with that, we need

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to do more research there because you could say that

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people who are depressed tend to spend more times on

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more time on their phone, because when we're depressed, we

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tend to cut ourselves off socially, and you're potentially looking

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for those connections through your phone as opposed to going

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out into the world, and that's a symptom of depression.

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So whether it's a cause or a correlation, I'm not sure,

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but I do know that there's other research about particularly

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about Facebook use and depression and anxiety, and there's lots

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of reasons for that, and you know, we can talk

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about what the problems are for sure.

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Yeah, what are some of the other problems with being

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on our phones all the time? I mean, for myself,

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I find the fear of missing out fomo. That's a

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real thing.

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Yeah, the phomo thing is a big one, I think,

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particularly for young people. And it's the fact that we

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are presented with what everybody else is doing, and we

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almost we see We've said this before that we see

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everybody else's highlights, real and the fun that people are having,

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and we see a distorted view of people's real lives.

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And then we compare our real life and all of

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our anxieties and flaws and worries and struggles with what

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we think other people are doing. And if you're not

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really attuned to that, or even if you are, you

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can't help but sort of buy into that a little bit.

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And the more people more time people spend on social media,

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the more depressed they tend to be.

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Because you're comparing two people aren't you.

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And Instagram, in fact, I just remembered it's the worst

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for that. I think it's because it's a visual platform,

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and so we see a lot of very pretty, filtered,

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polished images of all of the fun.

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Professional images most of the time celebrities things.

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Yeah, well not even celebrities, though we can look at

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the celebrities, but what about it just our normal friends

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who always seem to be having a great time, and

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their kids seem to always be really well behaved, and

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they're always having a holiday and having picnics and beautiful

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lunches and restaurant meals. We see it all, well, we're

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kind of seeing it at home, feeling a bit miserable

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and you know, stressed or whatever is going on, which

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is very normal real life, and we're comparing it to

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a distorted view of other people's lives.

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And not only the comparison and the fear of missing out,

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but there's also bullying. There's more bible where we used

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to just have bullying in the school yard where someone

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comes up face to face or you know, you have

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to be in the same room as a person.

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Now it's all filters lined.

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Yeah, that's the scariest thing for me because my daughter's

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just started high school and she doesn't have a phone.

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She's eleven and a half. She would tell me that

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everybody else has got a phone except her. I don't

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believe that to be true, and I don't even care

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she's not having one. Yeah, because we even Steve Jobs

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and even Mark Zuckerberg. Is it Mark Zuckerberg. No, but

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the people who developed the Bill Gates sorry, Bill Gates

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and Steve Jobs said that they would not let their

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kids have phones until they were fourteen or fifteen. And

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they know. They're the people on the inside that know

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how dangerous and how addictive they are, and they won't

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let their kids. So I think it's enough for Steve

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Jobs and Bill Gates, it's good enough for me.

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As a taekwando instructor, we have classes for kids as

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young as four, and little four year olds were coming

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in with a phone touched to them on a lanyard

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around their necks, and they knew how to operate it,

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how to ring mum, how to text mum when they'll

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finish class.

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But of course they're on games straight after class. Yeah.

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Yeah, So it's as young as that that they have

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their own phones. On a lanyard, and I just think, oh,

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this is bad because it is so addictive.

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And can you tell us Cass Howard is addictive in

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your brain?

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Yeah.

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The thing about addiction is that if you think particularly

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about say, gambling addiction and poker machines, they operate on

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this this principle of intermit and variable reward. So you

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never know when you're going to get a hit, when

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you're going to get a win, So you keep on

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going back and going back, and then you get a

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win and ding ding ding. You know, the dopamine receptors

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in your brain, you know, go off, and so that

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draws you back to keep on going.

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Having a machine, it's a slot machine.

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And so phones act phones sort of function very similarly.

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It's this every time I pick it up, is there

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going to be a message or another for cash? Is

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somebody going to a like a comment? You know? And

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so we we thrive on that, whether we think we

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do or we don't, or we don't believe it. We

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we kind of are hooked on that that feedback, you know,

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that social feedback and the like and the comment, and

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there'll be a message, or there'll be an email, or

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there'll be I'll check my email. If there's no email,

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then I'll check my instant message, and then I'll check Instagram,

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and then I'll check You know, we just see this

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constant checking, check, checking, and every now and again there'll

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be something and that draws us back in. The thing

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about dopamine is it's we call it the rewards center

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in the brain. It's actually the motivation center. Dopamine in

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and of itself doesn't give us a reward. There's other

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parts of the brain that light up with reward, but

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dopamine is the thing that identifies something as rewarding and

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so it compels you towards that thing. So this is

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where ques when we talk about habits, you know, on

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queues and behaviors and then rewards. So certain ques and

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certain triggers and the environment just being bored, just sitting

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down waiting for a coffee or waiting for the bus

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is a queue to do the habit, which is the

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pull out the phone and you get the reward of

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the notification. And so that's wired into our brain to

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continue to seek that reward. And dopamine's very powerful. I mean,

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that's the driver of all of our addictive behaviors. Is

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we are heavily, heavily motivated and compelled to do that thing,

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and it becomes habitual. Habitual things become addictive things.

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And we're not saying that social media is all evil

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or that the phone is evil, because I love my phone.

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It is my map, it's my alarm clock, it's my calendar.

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Everything's in that phone and it's so convenient. And also

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running an online business, I find I help mums to

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exercise at home who can't leave the house or go

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to the gym. I'm so proud of what online can do.

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Yeah, I agree, And that's the problem with it. Yeah,

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it's because it serves some really useful purposes.

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It is, and it can be very positive. But we're

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just about balance, aren't we, cass for sure.

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And even social media. We talk about social media and

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the links to depression and the dopamine and the addiction.

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That connection can also be positive. That connection can be

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very positive. I love being able to connect with people.

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I've moved into state four times or something, and I

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can keep up with all of the people that I

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would have normally lost contact with.

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And look at our community. We've got people all over

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the world who.

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We know and we coach and who who of you

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know friends and finding ways to make change.

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That's great, but we're trying.

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To just give you some tools and tips and to

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help you to be aware of adlic can.

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Identify with problem and yeah, be able to do something

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about that. Because I was going to say too, there

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are lots of really beyond social media. Our phone has

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I always recommend mindfulness meditation apps. We track our fitness,

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we can track our sleep. There's lots of really positive

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functionalities built into phones as well, as you said, our

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camera and our music, and our GPS and our maps

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and everything is in there. Weather the weather. I checked

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the weather. But that's the reason it becomes so difficult

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to separate from it. If you do notice that it's

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becoming quite compulsive. We all know when it gets a

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bit compulsive, then it's really difficult to take a break

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from it because there's so much use, fullness and functionality

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built into it as well.

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So you can take your break from it, you can,

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or you can just look at ways that that device

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is impacting your relationships as well.

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Speaking of which I'm glad you mentioned that because there

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is some research that shows that the mere presence of

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a phone that did some research where they got people

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to sit down and have a conversation, and just the

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mere presence of a phone, even if nobody was looking

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at it, or there was there was no action happening

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on the phone, just a phone sitting on the table

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reduces the level of trust and intimacy in that conversation.

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People are less inclined to be open and sharing in

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a conversation if there's a phone present.

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It's amazing.

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And you know, the other thing it does, or what

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it has done, is that constant sort of needing to check,

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or that constant distractedness, because we know board it's reduced

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our attention spend. We're highly distractible now, and so focusing

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on a project or focusing on I mean, I do

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some writing for a living, as you know, and I

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so do you. And I guess down and I start writing,

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writing writing, and I go bitbored. Check Facebook, check my email.

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This constant distracts.

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We talked about how we're not fans of multitasking.

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We're not fans of multitasking, but this is what we

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do because we can't sustain our attention for any length

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of time anymore.

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And I.

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Read recently that if you get a message, like we know,

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if you get a message and you check it. I've

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been in workplaces with people who are constantly like they're

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working and they're checking a message in replying. They're back

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to work and then the're checking a message and replying

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and well you just put it away. But even if

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you get a message, and even if you don't respond

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to it, it reduces.

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Your Okay, it's not thinking about it. I respond straight

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away just so I don't have that hanging over my head.

283
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There you go and think about that when you're driving.

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So what they're saying is, if you're driving a car,

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even if you if your phone's next to you, even

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if you don't look at the message, your attention is

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not on driving, it's actually on the message that's unread.

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So it's very dangerous actually. So there's lots of you know,

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there's more and more and more research coming out that's

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highlighting some of these issues and the reasons why we

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need to create some space from our devices.

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And it can be simple things, and we'll come back

293
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and talk about those tips and tools.

294
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And what about sleep. I have a really terrible habit

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winding down.

296
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Has begun getting in bed and my husband goes earlier

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because he gets up earlier than me, and I creep.

298
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Into bed after the baby's asleep.

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Everything's done, and it's my time to get on Facebook,

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get on Instagram, and scroll through my phone. And it's

301
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actually like relaxation for me. Why is that so bad

302
00:14:40.639 --> 00:14:41.279
from my sleep?

303
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We've talked about this. It is so bad because still

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doing it. Yeah, So the blue light from your screens,

305
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not just phones, but all electronic screens. I think the

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only the one that's okay is the Kindle. If you're

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reading a book on a Kindle, boo, because that's been

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designed to have a healthier lot, different light. But the

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blue light from those screens, what it does is it stimulates. Sorry,

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what it does is it slows down melatonin production. So

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melatonin is the hormone that calms you down quartersol in

312
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the morning, ReBs you up, gets you ready for the day,

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and your natural biological cycle is that as the day

314
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goes on and as evening comes and it gets dark,

315
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the melotonin increases to make you drowsy. So when you

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are looking at a blue light on your phone, what

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00:15:24.240 --> 00:15:27.080
it's doing is your brains getting confusing signals because it's

318
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thinking I'm supposed to be winding down, but this blue

319
00:15:29.039 --> 00:15:31.279
light's telling me to wake up, and it can keep

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you very alert and impact the quality and of your sleep.

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The other thing is the content that you're looking at.

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If it's an email comes through, or if something comes

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through and you feel compelled as we do, to reply

324
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or to comment, or something comes through for work and

325
00:15:48.600 --> 00:15:50.759
then you're thinking about it, then that is going to

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play on your mind and impact your sleep as well.

327
00:15:53.799 --> 00:15:57.039
So the space, you know, the phone's in bed, it's

328
00:15:57.240 --> 00:15:59.960
very like a lot of people. A lot of people

329
00:16:01.559 --> 00:16:03.879
do that and hop into bed and they started playing

330
00:16:03.879 --> 00:16:06.200
a game to wind down, a bit of candy crushing

331
00:16:06.399 --> 00:16:09.360
or something. But it really does impact your sleep and

332
00:16:09.399 --> 00:16:10.440
it's not good.

333
00:16:10.559 --> 00:16:11.480
It's not good at all.

334
00:16:11.759 --> 00:16:14.720
So I have some tips that I'm trying to implement

335
00:16:15.360 --> 00:16:17.919
to change my habits a little bit and bring back

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that balance. We're going to take a quick break and

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we'll be back with those tips and pools in a sec.

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You're listening to Crappy to Happy with Tiff and Cats.

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We're talking about digital detoxing, just bringing.

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Back a bit of balance.

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If we want to take a digital detox, it doesn't

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00:16:36.600 --> 00:16:40.320
mean going cold Turkey, putting your phone away, and then

343
00:16:40.519 --> 00:16:44.840
living in the dark ages. Bid Yeah, God forbid not

344
00:16:44.919 --> 00:16:46.639
having a phone with you. But there are a few

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00:16:46.679 --> 00:16:49.679
things you can do to create healthier habits. For example,

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I am trying to get off my phone in bed

347
00:16:52.879 --> 00:16:56.000
because I find I'm so busy with the baby that

348
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I don't get to have that time on my phone,

349
00:16:58.039 --> 00:16:59.679
which I love, and the only time I'm doing it

350
00:16:59.759 --> 00:17:03.879
is in So two things I'm doing. I'm making sure

351
00:17:03.919 --> 00:17:07.000
that my charger, my phone charger isn't beside my bed,

352
00:17:07.119 --> 00:17:09.359
but I've set up a charging station in the kitchen,

353
00:17:09.880 --> 00:17:12.400
so I put my phone down and it charges overnight

354
00:17:12.440 --> 00:17:13.039
in the kitchen.

355
00:17:13.680 --> 00:17:15.759
Arnie is my alarm he wakes me up early.

356
00:17:16.039 --> 00:17:18.640
And I also have another alarm clock as like an

357
00:17:18.640 --> 00:17:22.519
old school just an alarm clock as my backup.

358
00:17:22.160 --> 00:17:24.640
If Arnie sleeps in, which he never does. So that's

359
00:17:24.640 --> 00:17:25.480
two things you can do.

360
00:17:25.559 --> 00:17:27.559
Get an old school alarm clock and set up your

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00:17:27.640 --> 00:17:29.440
charging station outside of the bedroom.

362
00:17:29.920 --> 00:17:33.039
Yeah, keeping the phone out of the bedroom is a

363
00:17:33.119 --> 00:17:36.000
really really important one. I think for all of those

364
00:17:36.039 --> 00:17:39.519
reasons that we talked about to do with sleep, I

365
00:17:39.559 --> 00:17:44.880
think also that turning your phone off, Oh I know

366
00:17:45.039 --> 00:17:47.519
it makes people nervous, but I think if you can

367
00:17:47.519 --> 00:17:51.039
turn your phone off at least thirty minutes before you

368
00:17:51.119 --> 00:17:53.400
go to bed and give yourself a break from that.

369
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Wil life down time.

370
00:17:54.720 --> 00:17:57.200
Yeah. So you know, we did talk a lot about

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00:17:57.200 --> 00:18:00.079
that in detail in season one in our sleep episode.

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00:18:00.279 --> 00:18:03.839
So just to reinforce that point of getting getting off

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00:18:03.880 --> 00:18:07.519
your phone thirty minutes before bed, and I like to

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00:18:07.960 --> 00:18:11.039
then say, keep it off when you wake up in

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00:18:11.039 --> 00:18:14.000
the morning. Don't turn it on straight away. If it's on,

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00:18:14.200 --> 00:18:16.240
even if you've got it in flight mode, you will

377
00:18:16.319 --> 00:18:18.000
tend to just get up and go straight to it,

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00:18:18.079 --> 00:18:20.880
whereas if it's off and you wait until after you've

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00:18:21.400 --> 00:18:24.559
done some meditation, had your cup of tea, had a coffee,

380
00:18:24.640 --> 00:18:26.799
whatever it might be. But to give yourself that time

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00:18:26.799 --> 00:18:29.119
in the morning, while your brain is fresh and open

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00:18:29.160 --> 00:18:32.279
and clear, just give yourself a break before you actually

383
00:18:32.640 --> 00:18:35.240
turn it back on and start to be hit again

384
00:18:35.319 --> 00:18:38.160
with all of that stimulation of all of the emails

385
00:18:38.160 --> 00:18:40.440
and the social media and what's happened overnight and.

386
00:18:40.640 --> 00:18:42.160
Feeling what have you missed out?

387
00:18:42.240 --> 00:18:45.759
Compelled to check what happened overnight on Facebook or whatever

388
00:18:45.839 --> 00:18:46.160
it is.

389
00:18:46.559 --> 00:18:49.079
So that is so helpful.

390
00:18:49.400 --> 00:18:51.680
Keep it off. I do that. I keep it out

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00:18:51.680 --> 00:18:53.319
of the bedroom for sure. We've always had an old

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00:18:53.319 --> 00:18:55.559
school alarm clock. Don't know how to think. They don't

393
00:18:55.559 --> 00:18:57.720
make them like they used to. It's been going for

394
00:18:57.759 --> 00:19:01.160
fifteen years or something. But I keep the phone out

395
00:19:01.160 --> 00:19:03.359
of the bedroom generally, and I have made it a

396
00:19:03.400 --> 00:19:05.880
rule to turn it off and to not turn it

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00:19:05.960 --> 00:19:08.400
on immediately have a break in the morning.

398
00:19:08.480 --> 00:19:11.000
And when I was working with a sleep specialist who

399
00:19:11.000 --> 00:19:14.519
came in and just helped us with some tips for Arnold,

400
00:19:14.559 --> 00:19:16.880
one of the first things she said is when he's

401
00:19:16.920 --> 00:19:19.559
winding down before bedtime, he's had his bath, he's had

402
00:19:19.559 --> 00:19:22.440
his feet and now it's bed The winding downtime is

403
00:19:22.480 --> 00:19:25.839
so important. And she said half an hour, make sure

404
00:19:25.880 --> 00:19:28.440
there's no screens around him. So sometimes I realized he

405
00:19:28.519 --> 00:19:29.839
was sitting on my lap and I'm.

406
00:19:29.720 --> 00:19:31.240
Texting, so he's getting the blue light.

407
00:19:31.279 --> 00:19:33.119
But yeah, he's getting the blue light, or he's the

408
00:19:33.200 --> 00:19:36.359
TV's on in the background, or there were screens and

409
00:19:36.400 --> 00:19:40.759
stimulation and the overstimulation of watching television even if he's

410
00:19:40.839 --> 00:19:43.279
lying on his mate, he's not even sitting up, was

411
00:19:43.359 --> 00:19:46.720
keeping him up. So now all screens are off and

412
00:19:46.960 --> 00:19:50.680
until he's fast asleep, I'm making sure that that's the

413
00:19:50.720 --> 00:19:53.000
thing in the house. And it just really it was

414
00:19:53.039 --> 00:19:56.319
a great shock to put me into action to make sure, Okay,

415
00:19:56.640 --> 00:19:58.720
I've really got to put the phone down at night

416
00:19:58.759 --> 00:20:00.920
and I've got a wind down like a baby does.

417
00:20:01.039 --> 00:20:03.400
Exactly. We all need that little bedtime routine.

418
00:20:03.440 --> 00:20:05.519
So if you want more advice on how to have

419
00:20:05.599 --> 00:20:07.839
better sleep Hygen, go back to season one or Crappy

420
00:20:07.880 --> 00:20:10.039
to Happy, because we do talk about it in depth.

421
00:20:10.759 --> 00:20:13.559
Phones do impact, like you said, the trust and the

422
00:20:13.680 --> 00:20:16.279
openness when you're having a conversation with someone having your

423
00:20:16.319 --> 00:20:18.920
phone there. So a great thing I do when I

424
00:20:18.960 --> 00:20:22.000
catch up with my friends, I say to them, hey,

425
00:20:22.119 --> 00:20:24.960
let's phone stack. So when we start we get we

426
00:20:25.480 --> 00:20:27.559
put the phones out of sight and we stack them

427
00:20:27.599 --> 00:20:30.160
up and like that game gender, if you pull your

428
00:20:30.200 --> 00:20:31.920
phone out, the whole sack's going to fall over. You

429
00:20:31.920 --> 00:20:34.240
don't want to be the person that collapses the stack.

430
00:20:34.960 --> 00:20:35.759
You can just relax.

431
00:20:35.799 --> 00:20:37.720
The phones a stacked there and it's a great way

432
00:20:37.799 --> 00:20:40.039
to just have fun. And I do that if I'm

433
00:20:40.079 --> 00:20:42.519
having people over for dinner. Don't go out too much

434
00:20:42.559 --> 00:20:46.559
these days. I find the phone sacking really helps just away,

435
00:20:46.599 --> 00:20:48.000
they don't have to be on the table.

436
00:20:48.240 --> 00:20:50.920
Yeah, keep them away and making it a group rule.

437
00:20:51.000 --> 00:20:53.119
I think yes, and people are happy to do that.

438
00:20:53.160 --> 00:20:56.000
They go, yeah, yeah, let's put the phones away, let's relax.

439
00:20:56.119 --> 00:20:59.519
Yeah. I think another really good one is to if

440
00:20:59.519 --> 00:21:01.720
people have trouble weaning off. I know you said, like

441
00:21:01.799 --> 00:21:03.599
you don't need to go cold turkey, but you know what,

442
00:21:03.680 --> 00:21:06.279
sometimes actually you might want to look at building up

443
00:21:06.319 --> 00:21:08.000
to having a day off.

444
00:21:08.640 --> 00:21:11.440
Yeah, like social media holiday or I know that.

445
00:21:11.839 --> 00:21:14.079
Ariana Huffington and Katie Perry when they did one of

446
00:21:14.119 --> 00:21:17.160
their podcasts, they talked about shut off Sunday, like just

447
00:21:17.400 --> 00:21:19.880
having a day off social media and having a day

448
00:21:19.920 --> 00:21:22.960
off technology for it for a day and if you

449
00:21:22.960 --> 00:21:25.119
can't do a day, maybe it's a half a day

450
00:21:25.200 --> 00:21:27.400
or maybe it's a few hours and start to build

451
00:21:27.400 --> 00:21:29.920
it up. But there's other ways that you can take

452
00:21:29.960 --> 00:21:33.559
a break without feeling completely disconnected. And one that I

453
00:21:33.680 --> 00:21:37.200
like is absolutely using flight mode. If you can put

454
00:21:37.200 --> 00:21:40.480
your phone in flight mode, because people get nervous because

455
00:21:40.519 --> 00:21:42.519
but I use my phone for my camera and I

456
00:21:42.640 --> 00:21:44.759
use it for my music if I'm going for a walk,

457
00:21:44.799 --> 00:21:46.759
so you can still access all those functions. If it's

458
00:21:46.759 --> 00:21:49.920
in flight mode. So that's the useful one. And I

459
00:21:49.920 --> 00:21:52.279
think the other really important one is turn off. I've

460
00:21:52.319 --> 00:21:56.480
done this, turn off notifications. It's the constant. Even the

461
00:21:56.519 --> 00:22:00.000
little you know, the little number in the red circle,

462
00:22:00.720 --> 00:22:03.680
pulls your attention. You compel to want to go and

463
00:22:03.759 --> 00:22:06.160
check what those notifications are. Oh, how many people have

464
00:22:06.359 --> 00:22:08.200
commented on that? How many people have liked that? How

465
00:22:08.200 --> 00:22:10.359
many emails have I got? So if you turn all

466
00:22:10.400 --> 00:22:12.960
of that off so that you're not drawn all the

467
00:22:13.039 --> 00:22:18.200
time to wanting to check notifications, not having your attention disturbed, yes,

468
00:22:18.240 --> 00:22:22.880
because very intrusive. Actually it is so turning off notifications,

469
00:22:23.559 --> 00:22:27.240
putting it in flight mode, putting it away when you're

470
00:22:27.279 --> 00:22:28.519
in a company for sure.

471
00:22:28.720 --> 00:22:29.160
For sure.

472
00:22:29.279 --> 00:22:31.799
And one thing that I've been doing. A couple of

473
00:22:31.839 --> 00:22:33.400
weeks ago, I went out and I bought a camera.

474
00:22:33.440 --> 00:22:36.160
I didn't own a camera because I held my phone.

475
00:22:36.160 --> 00:22:38.319
I picked up my phone to check a message, and

476
00:22:38.480 --> 00:22:41.759
Arnold smiled, and I realized that he was smiling at

477
00:22:41.759 --> 00:22:43.960
the phone because I take all these photos of him,

478
00:22:44.559 --> 00:22:47.119
and he's actually learnt to smile.

479
00:22:46.799 --> 00:22:48.200
When the phone's near him.

480
00:22:48.440 --> 00:22:48.839
Wow.

481
00:22:48.960 --> 00:22:50.119
So that freaked me out.

482
00:22:50.119 --> 00:22:52.000
So when I bought a camera, and I thought, I

483
00:22:52.039 --> 00:22:54.400
don't want him thinking I'm always on my phone, and

484
00:22:54.759 --> 00:22:56.400
but I always have my phone on me because I

485
00:22:56.400 --> 00:23:00.119
want to take baby photos. So getting a camera and

486
00:23:00.279 --> 00:23:02.960
help to not be on your phone as much and

487
00:23:03.039 --> 00:23:06.000
have that compulsive I've got to take a photo. And

488
00:23:06.119 --> 00:23:09.720
also something that I do with Ed at home, we

489
00:23:09.799 --> 00:23:12.200
seem to talk to each other through our phones. I'll

490
00:23:12.240 --> 00:23:14.799
be on my phone and I'm talking to him, and

491
00:23:14.880 --> 00:23:18.680
so we have a rule now where phone's down when I'm.

492
00:23:18.519 --> 00:23:21.359
Talking to you, look at me, phone down, eyes eyes up.

493
00:23:21.440 --> 00:23:24.160
And if I have my phone up, then I put

494
00:23:24.160 --> 00:23:26.519
two bucks in a little sweager just in the kitchen,

495
00:23:26.599 --> 00:23:29.319
and then we go out without our phones, have a

496
00:23:29.319 --> 00:23:31.920
coffee and it's like, oh, we made it through, you know,

497
00:23:32.039 --> 00:23:34.440
a whole coffee date without being on our phones, using

498
00:23:34.440 --> 00:23:35.920
the money from our phone sweagar.

499
00:23:36.279 --> 00:23:38.119
That you just touched on something really important when you

500
00:23:38.160 --> 00:23:40.400
mentioned Arnold, which we haven't even talked about, which is

501
00:23:40.440 --> 00:23:42.920
the impact on your kids.

502
00:23:42.920 --> 00:23:44.759
I'm really aware of this, yeah.

503
00:23:44.480 --> 00:23:47.480
Of us as adults being on phones, that lack of

504
00:23:47.880 --> 00:23:51.799
connected attention. When kids are around, they pick up on

505
00:23:51.880 --> 00:23:54.759
the fact that we're not fully present because we've constantly

506
00:23:54.799 --> 00:23:56.319
got our eyes on our phones.

507
00:23:56.480 --> 00:23:59.359
I'm so scared of this. That's why it's down now,

508
00:23:59.440 --> 00:24:00.880
it's apps down.

509
00:24:00.920 --> 00:24:03.359
And we talk about kids being on their phones all

510
00:24:03.400 --> 00:24:05.720
the time. As adults, we've got to take some responsibility

511
00:24:05.720 --> 00:24:08.519
for how much we are not present with the people

512
00:24:08.519 --> 00:24:10.880
around us, and especially our partners, and our is so.

513
00:24:10.839 --> 00:24:11.640
Much more important.

514
00:24:11.759 --> 00:24:14.400
And I just think, no, and no one's waiting for

515
00:24:14.440 --> 00:24:17.319
that post or that message from me or an update

516
00:24:17.400 --> 00:24:19.759
on Facebook. No one's waiting for it. As much as

517
00:24:19.759 --> 00:24:22.359
you feel like I have to let people know they're

518
00:24:22.359 --> 00:24:23.079
not waiting for it.

519
00:24:23.119 --> 00:24:25.880
Especially when you have a business like I do as well,

520
00:24:26.279 --> 00:24:28.839
and I get the guilts, like if I haven't posted

521
00:24:28.880 --> 00:24:31.440
on my social media, I think, oh gosh, I'm letting

522
00:24:31.480 --> 00:24:33.559
people down. Nobody actually cares.

523
00:24:33.359 --> 00:24:39.160
They're not keeping chats on They're not Unfortunately, no, Sadly,

524
00:24:39.400 --> 00:24:40.079
no one cares.

525
00:24:40.640 --> 00:24:42.680
So I think a lot of people don't realize how

526
00:24:42.680 --> 00:24:46.920
important that is to give kids, especially our full attention.

527
00:24:48.680 --> 00:24:52.160
And look, it's difficult because I know that sometimes stuff

528
00:24:52.200 --> 00:24:54.960
goes around you. We've talked about the Mummy Wars, and

529
00:24:55.000 --> 00:24:57.279
we don't want to go down that path of judging

530
00:24:57.279 --> 00:25:00.480
other parents because sometimes getting five minutes on your phone

531
00:25:00.680 --> 00:25:02.319
is like the only break you might get all day

532
00:25:02.319 --> 00:25:04.200
after a bad day. So we're not doing that. But

533
00:25:04.319 --> 00:25:07.519
I think just to be more aware as parents of

534
00:25:07.559 --> 00:25:11.920
where our attention is in the presence of children. That

535
00:25:12.079 --> 00:25:16.400
emotional connection, that emotional attachment is fundamental for healthy child

536
00:25:16.880 --> 00:25:22.680
development and for brain development, and for conversations and talking

537
00:25:22.680 --> 00:25:26.000
about feelings and facial expressions and all of that from

538
00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:29.119
infancy but all the way through childhood and growing up.

539
00:25:29.319 --> 00:25:33.039
Those healthy relationships are so crucial, and we are, I

540
00:25:33.079 --> 00:25:35.839
know sometimes in our house, so there's I might be

541
00:25:35.880 --> 00:25:38.279
on my phone looking at something. My daughter's just outed

542
00:25:38.359 --> 00:25:40.079
high school and she's got a laptop, so that's a

543
00:25:40.240 --> 00:25:42.839
huge novelty for her. Not that she's never been on

544
00:25:42.880 --> 00:25:45.880
technology before, but now she's got her own laptop for school.

545
00:25:45.920 --> 00:25:48.400
And my husband's a big iPad man, so he will

546
00:25:48.400 --> 00:25:51.000
often be reading the paper, for example, he reads the

547
00:25:51.359 --> 00:25:55.400
paper or things like that on his iPad rather than

548
00:25:55.440 --> 00:25:57.440
getting a hard copy paper. So where three of us

549
00:25:57.519 --> 00:25:59.000
can be in a room and all of us on

550
00:25:59.079 --> 00:26:02.680
our various screens, and sometimes one of us will just

551
00:26:02.720 --> 00:26:06.599
say enough, come on, you put them away, like enough

552
00:26:06.680 --> 00:26:08.920
is enough. But you've got to be aware of it.

553
00:26:09.000 --> 00:26:10.960
And catch yourself and make that.

554
00:26:11.079 --> 00:26:13.240
That's what a decision, just being aware of it.

555
00:26:13.279 --> 00:26:16.039
And also if something's coming through full work and I'm

556
00:26:16.079 --> 00:26:19.200
seeing a notification which I have turned off now, I.

557
00:26:19.119 --> 00:26:21.640
Just think, I feel like I have to answer that

558
00:26:21.720 --> 00:26:22.200
right now.

559
00:26:22.480 --> 00:26:24.480
But I take a moment and I say, I can

560
00:26:24.559 --> 00:26:27.920
answer that in twenty minutes when Arnold's having his nap, yes,

561
00:26:27.960 --> 00:26:29.920
and I can then have forty five minutes to get

562
00:26:29.960 --> 00:26:33.799
all done. But when he's awake, I'm mom, Yep, that's okay.

563
00:26:33.960 --> 00:26:37.880
Yeah. When my daughter was baby, I went back to

564
00:26:38.039 --> 00:26:40.839
UNI when she was about you know, I don't know,

565
00:26:40.920 --> 00:26:43.920
nine or ten months old, and yeah, and my husband

566
00:26:43.960 --> 00:26:45.519
moved into state at the same time, so it was

567
00:26:45.599 --> 00:26:49.759
just me. But that that point that you just made

568
00:26:49.880 --> 00:26:51.279
that was so important to me. Like when I was

569
00:26:51.319 --> 00:26:53.359
with her, I was one hundred percent with her because

570
00:26:53.400 --> 00:26:55.720
I felt so bad about leaving her and going off

571
00:26:55.759 --> 00:26:58.319
to study that I have made very clear boundaries. When

572
00:26:58.319 --> 00:27:01.319
we were together, I was one hundred percent on her,

573
00:27:01.440 --> 00:27:03.559
and then when she was asleep or when she was

574
00:27:03.599 --> 00:27:05.480
away or she was a daycare, then I was one

575
00:27:05.559 --> 00:27:08.240
hundred percent doing you know, my other stuff. And I

576
00:27:08.279 --> 00:27:10.759
think trying to keep some of those, it's not always

577
00:27:10.839 --> 00:27:13.039
one hundred percent possible trying to keep some of those

578
00:27:13.079 --> 00:27:16.440
boundaries when the phone tends to filter into every aspect

579
00:27:16.440 --> 00:27:20.039
of life, just you know, just to be aware to

580
00:27:20.119 --> 00:27:22.440
keep it a bit separate. And I think if you

581
00:27:22.559 --> 00:27:25.720
really want to go hard with the digital detos, which

582
00:27:26.119 --> 00:27:28.079
can be a really good thing, like having that break

583
00:27:28.119 --> 00:27:31.079
can be really important, you know, go away for a

584
00:27:31.119 --> 00:27:33.799
weekend or spend a whole day, you know, or take

585
00:27:33.839 --> 00:27:35.839
yourself away and not be on your phone at all.

586
00:27:36.400 --> 00:27:37.599
It can be one of the best things that you

587
00:27:37.599 --> 00:27:39.640
can do. But what happens is we get this anxiety

588
00:27:39.799 --> 00:27:42.640
about what if somebody's trying to contact me? So I

589
00:27:42.640 --> 00:27:45.400
always say, well, if you can set up auto responders

590
00:27:45.400 --> 00:27:47.119
on your email, but even if you just text the

591
00:27:47.160 --> 00:27:50.000
people closest to you and say I'm offline. If you're

592
00:27:50.000 --> 00:27:52.319
concern that somebody's going to try and contact you, more

593
00:27:52.319 --> 00:27:55.519
than likely they're not. But you can actually tell people

594
00:27:55.920 --> 00:27:59.640
I deactivate my Facebook account. Sometimes I've seen you do

595
00:27:59.720 --> 00:28:02.920
this and I'd say to people, Okay, time for a break,

596
00:28:02.920 --> 00:28:05.240
I'm deactivating Facebook. And you know the funniest thing about that,

597
00:28:05.400 --> 00:28:07.640
as soon as you deactivate Facebook, nobody can actually see

598
00:28:07.640 --> 00:28:10.720
that message. So except for the people who see it

599
00:28:11.160 --> 00:28:12.960
right in that moment, I put it up and I

600
00:28:13.039 --> 00:28:15.000
leave it there for a few hours so that people

601
00:28:15.079 --> 00:28:16.920
see it because it makes me feel better that people

602
00:28:16.920 --> 00:28:19.519
don't think I've just disappeared or unfriended them or something.

603
00:28:19.960 --> 00:28:22.839
And then I just say, right, I'm offline. About three

604
00:28:22.839 --> 00:28:25.720
hours later, then I'll deactivate it. I'll keep it off.

605
00:28:25.799 --> 00:28:28.200
The other thing I haven't mentioned to is taking off.

606
00:28:28.240 --> 00:28:30.880
If you've got a particular compulsion to be checking, for example,

607
00:28:30.920 --> 00:28:33.319
Facebook or Instagram on your phone, you can actually just

608
00:28:33.359 --> 00:28:34.599
remove the app from your phone.

609
00:28:34.599 --> 00:28:35.559
I've done that before.

610
00:28:35.599 --> 00:28:38.480
I've done that before too, and for a while there

611
00:28:40.079 --> 00:28:42.079
surely go for your phone and oh, that's right, it's

612
00:28:42.119 --> 00:28:44.640
not there anymore. And that can be a nice way

613
00:28:44.680 --> 00:28:47.160
to break that habit, because if it's not there and

614
00:28:47.200 --> 00:28:49.960
you can't check it, you stop checking it. It like

615
00:28:50.039 --> 00:28:53.359
eliminates that habit, and then later on you might be

616
00:28:53.359 --> 00:28:55.559
able to put it back on, but that compulsion's not there.

617
00:28:55.960 --> 00:28:58.640
I find the same with just deactivating Facebook. Actually, after

618
00:28:58.680 --> 00:29:01.359
a few weeks you really that you're actually not really

619
00:29:01.400 --> 00:29:02.119
missing very.

620
00:29:02.039 --> 00:29:04.359
Much, and your real friends will call you and you're

621
00:29:04.400 --> 00:29:05.920
good friends will patch up and.

622
00:29:06.000 --> 00:29:08.440
Don't come by at all. No, it's it's a good

623
00:29:08.519 --> 00:29:12.160
lesson to see how much you are not missing when

624
00:29:12.200 --> 00:29:15.000
you take a complete break from some of those things.

625
00:29:15.240 --> 00:29:16.319
So I encourage it.

626
00:29:16.559 --> 00:29:19.000
And now people are even wearing their phones on their wrists.

627
00:29:19.039 --> 00:29:23.480
You've got watches and fitbits with alerts and messages and

628
00:29:23.559 --> 00:29:26.680
phone calls coming through your watch, so you can feel

629
00:29:26.759 --> 00:29:29.079
that pressure to always respond.

630
00:29:29.720 --> 00:29:31.720
And you're on twenty four to seven.

631
00:29:31.799 --> 00:29:33.279
Yeah, I hadn't even thought of that. I have got

632
00:29:33.279 --> 00:29:35.279
a fitbit and I wore it for a little bit

633
00:29:35.319 --> 00:29:37.839
and I lost its novelty and then I lost the

634
00:29:37.880 --> 00:29:40.559
fitbit and I haven't bothered about finding it or replacing it.

635
00:29:40.599 --> 00:29:43.079
But my husband has a fitbit as well, and I

636
00:29:43.160 --> 00:29:45.160
know we'll be having a conversation and suddenly he looks

637
00:29:45.160 --> 00:29:47.359
at his wrist and he disappears from the room because

638
00:29:47.359 --> 00:29:49.519
he really he gets a text message or something on

639
00:29:49.559 --> 00:29:52.519
his phone and it comes through on his watch, and

640
00:29:52.559 --> 00:29:55.799
then he's even without the phone present, he's disappeared out

641
00:29:55.799 --> 00:29:57.839
of the room to check a message. Yes, that's only

642
00:29:57.839 --> 00:30:00.160
because I see this quick flick of the wrist that

643
00:30:00.200 --> 00:30:01.880
I know going on.

644
00:30:02.119 --> 00:30:03.480
It's still there, and.

645
00:30:03.440 --> 00:30:06.359
He I mean, bless him. He has an important job

646
00:30:06.400 --> 00:30:08.640
and it gets a lot of important messages so that

647
00:30:08.680 --> 00:30:11.119
he has to respond to. But you know what, sometimes

648
00:30:11.160 --> 00:30:12.279
I feel like saying it.

649
00:30:12.160 --> 00:30:14.799
Can wait, Yeah, it can wait, and all the same.

650
00:30:14.839 --> 00:30:17.640
I've been weighing up getting one because I can't sometimes

651
00:30:17.640 --> 00:30:19.839
holding a baby and holding a phone. I don't have

652
00:30:19.920 --> 00:30:21.880
two hands all the time, so I thought maybe a

653
00:30:21.920 --> 00:30:25.160
watch would be better being one handed. But I think

654
00:30:25.279 --> 00:30:27.880
it would just fuel my addiction further. So I'm going

655
00:30:27.920 --> 00:30:28.960
to wait.

656
00:30:29.160 --> 00:30:31.920
Yeah, yeah, I think that we'll limit it limited to yeah.

657
00:30:32.000 --> 00:30:34.720
Can I'm struggling with my addiction with the phone, let

658
00:30:34.720 --> 00:30:37.880
alone a phone watch. We hope you find some helpful

659
00:30:37.920 --> 00:30:40.960
tips and tools there to deal with the digital detox.

660
00:30:40.640 --> 00:30:42.359
If you want to take one, or to round out

661
00:30:42.359 --> 00:30:43.039
that balance.

662
00:30:43.680 --> 00:30:46.359
Next on Crappy to Happy, we're going to be talking

663
00:30:46.400 --> 00:30:49.240
about killer self confidence and how to be more confident

664
00:30:49.640 --> 00:30:52.359
and assertive. Thanks for tuning in and we'll talk to

665
00:30:52.359 --> 00:30:52.720
you soon.

666
00:30:58.720 --> 00:31:01.440
Crappy to Happy is presented by Cast Done produced by

667
00:31:01.519 --> 00:31:10.039
Davis Lensky, Audio production by Darcy Thompson. Listener